Jim Lenz: 0:02
California just made history and it’s a story with major implications for our entire industry. For the first time ever, E-15 fuel is poised to become legal in the nation’s largest state. Following the unanimous passage of Assembly Bill 30, this landmark decision could mean lower prices, cleaner air, and stronger demand for corn and ethanol. Changes that reach deep in the grain handling and processing world. In this episode of the Whole Grain Podcast, you’ll hear the inside story from someone who helped make it happen. Geoff Cooper, President and CEO of the Renewable Fuels Association, joins me to share how years of persistence in coalition building and strategy paid off. And one of these breakthrough measures for consumers, retailers, policymakers, grain handlers, grain processors, vendors and suppliers, and of course, producers and farmers. From the behind-the-scenes effort in Sacramento to the ripple effects across the Midwest and beyond, this conversation explores how a single bill could reshape the renewable fuels landscape for decades to come. Stay tuned. The Whole Grain show brings grain professionals like you together from 94 countries from around the world. My name is Jim Lens, your host and director of global education and training at Jeeps, where the mission of the Grain Elevator and Processing Society is to champion, connect, and serve the global grain industry and our members. Today we’re turning our attention to one of the biggest renewable fuel developments in recent memory, California’s AB30 and what it means for ethanol, grain, and the future of energy. Geoff Cooper is here to walk us through how it happened, why it matters, and what’s next. And just like recent episodes, we’ll wrap up with reflection questions you can use with your team to turn today’s insights into action. All that and more coming up next. We are connecting with Geoff Cooper. Welcome and thank you for serving as guests in the Whole Grain Podcast, Geoff. Well, thanks for having me, Jim. Now, our listeners work in the grain handling and processing industry. In case they may be unfamiliar with RFA, could you share the work of the Renewable Fuels Association and who you represent?
Geoff Cooper: 2:38
Yeah, so the Renewable Fuels Association is the nation’s oldest and most authoritative trade association for America’s ethanol producers and frankly the larger ethanol industry. RFA was originally founded in 1981, so we’ve been around as long as the ethanol industry itself has been in existence here in the United States, more than 40 years. Our members are primarily ethanol producers, and they really come in all shapes and sizes. We have big agribusiness companies, we have farmer-owned co-ops and LLCs, we have big producers, small producers. You know, most of our member producers are using corn as a feedstock, but we’ve also got facilities that use a fair amount of grain sorghum. And then we have even very small companies that are using waste products as feedstock to make ethanol. So food and beverage processing waste and other waste streams are being converted into ethanol, and we represent those folks as well. We also have associate members, and those are companies that are vendors to the industry, their suppliers, their farm groups, their marketers, their shippers. We have rail companies that are part of the RFA, for example. So a very broad and diverse membership. But our focus, of course, is advancing policies that help expand the market for ethanol and drive demand and drive growth in the industry, really across all facets of the marketplace. We also have some members that are looking at new uses and applications of ethanol. We talk about sustainable aviation fuel and chemical uses and potentially maritime fuel. So we have some of those companies involved in our membership as well.
Jim Lenz: 4:21
Certainly an exciting time, and uh, we’re gonna talk about how exciting really this is with new developments that you, your organization and others have done here as a main topic. But I do want to point out that I think this is the the case, and please confirm that the the grain processing industry not only supports high employment of military veterans, but they are one of the leaders in the composition of military veterans as far as industries go. Is that correct?
Geoff Cooper: 4:48
That’s exactly right. And in fact, the Department of Energy produces a report every year, sort of a survey across different energy sectors. And what they have consistently found in the last several years is that the ethanol industry specifically employs a larger share of veterans than any other segment of the energy industry. Uh, something around 16% of our workforce are veterans of the armed forces. And that’s particularly gratifying to me because I myself am a veteran. I spent some time in the U.S. Army where my focus was on petroleum product logistics and distribution. So my unit’s mission was to move fuel to wherever it was needed on the battlefield. We were refueling everything from tanks and helicopters to generators and Humvees. So it is, I think, sort of full circle for me to be working and helping to lead an industry that has such a connection and commitment to our veterans. I think a lot of veterans find a home in this industry because the goals and the values and the mission align very well with what they were doing in the military. And those skill sets that they learned in the military also transfer very well into the ethanol and ag industries. You know, after I left the Army, I spent five years at the National Corn Growers Association working on ethanol market development and policy issues, and then came to RFA in 2008. So I’ve been here about 17 years in various capacities and serving as the CEO for the last six or seven years.
Jim Lenz: 6:27
Fantastic. Great background on the organization, who your members are, who you support, and actually you provide even more than I expected there for the military. And I like how you shared that there’s alignment. So anybody out there listening who is a military veteran or who knows someone, get in contact with RFA. How does that sound?
Geoff Cooper: 6:47
Absolutely. And we actually have a veterans for renewable fuels group that we support. It’s it’s very active, it’s a great network for veterans working in the industry and and even veterans just interested in what we’re doing in this industry to get together and talk.
Jim Lenz: 7:01
Fantastic. That’s a wonderful thing you do. In fact, uh I don’t think you mentioned this, but you actually were an officer in the Army. Is that correct?
Geoff Cooper: 7:08
I was. I ended up achieving the rank of captain before I got out. So again, wonderful experience in the Army. I I learned so much, not just about the fuel business and moving fuel and the logistics involved in doing that, but just so many other skills that have served me well in this role and serve me well in life.
Jim Lenz: 7:27
Fantastic. Your colleague, Robert White, he was a guest in the whole grain podcast before. He has that background as well. I encourage listeners to, after they listen to this episode, uh make sure you do that. And if you’re a member of Jeeps, you have access to the video library. And he spoke at the Jeeps Exchange, a big annual event for the green industry there. And uh you can uh listen and watch him do his one of his presentations. So great to have connections here. I know John Calpert, our CEO of Jeeps, has been a big uh proponent of making good connections here, and we’re all aligned, both organizations are aligned, so it’s fantastic. Absolutely. So now let’s set the scene. California state passes AB 30, 39 to 0, now just one step from becoming law. Tell us about that. Why is it historic for our listeners?
Geoff Cooper: 8:15
Well, it’s a huge story, and you’re absolutely right. Uh Assembly Bill 30 passed out of the Senate on September 3rd. That was the final step in the legislative process. And what makes it even more fascinating is it passed unanimously, 39 to zero, as you mentioned, out of the Senate. Uh, but every vote on this bill was unanimous, coming out of the assembly on a unanimous vote, coming out of the committees where review of this legislation first started. Those were all unanimous votes. So we’ve never seen in the history of the ethanol industry an ethanol-friendly bill make its way through the California legislature, period, let alone come through that process with unanimous support on every single vote. It really is a big deal. And I think it it really speaks to the fact that California policymakers are recognizing the tremendous opportunity and the potential here with expanding ethanol use in that state to help lower costs for their consumers, help further clean up the air, help extend fuel supplies. There’s just so many benefits, and I know we’re going to talk about some of that, but this is a monumental achievement. It was something a lot of folks a year ago, two years ago, when we started down this road, thought was not possible. And we just kept pushing ahead. And here we are today, just one step away from this bill becoming law. We’re just waiting on the governor’s signature at this point.
Jim Lenz: 9:43
That’s fantastic. So 39 to 0 is a vote. Why is it significant that this bill passed unanimously in both chambers?
Geoff Cooper: 9:51
Well, again, I think it really speaks to the fact that legislators in the state of California are recognizing they have a problem. Petroleum refineries are leaving the state or announcing their plans to leave the state. There are still millions, tens of millions of vehicles on the road in California that run on liquid fuels. And certainly their policy priorities have been around, you know, a transition to electric vehicles. But the bottom line is consumers are saying, look, I can’t afford an electric vehicle. I don’t want an electric vehicle. I like my 2005 Chevy Silver Auto or, you know, whatever they’re driving, and they need fuels and they need access to affordable fuels to continue powering those vehicles. And I think there’s a good recognition of that in the legislature. I think there’s a growing recognition of that in Governor Newsom’s office. And so that’s why this is such a historic moment is they’re they’re seeing E-15 as a way to help address those concerns that they’re hearing from voters in the state.
Jim Lenz: 10:49
Fantastic. Walk us through what happens next with Governor Newsome’s desk. What are the odds of signature?
Geoff Cooper: 10:55
Well, and first I should say what the bill does. And the bill uh immediately legalizes E-15 in the state of California. The legislature basically said, look, we’re tired of waiting on the regulatory agencies to do this. We’re going to take the bull by the horns here. They saw an opportunity to get lower-cost fuels into the marketplace and they took it. And so the next step following passage of this bill out of the Senate is for the governor to sign it. It’s sitting on his desk awaiting signature. He has 30 days from the date when he received the bill. We do expect that he will sign the bill into law. He’s expressed support for E-15 in the past. He’s called on those regulatory agencies to expedite their process. So that’s it. I mean, we’re just waiting anxiously for Governor Newsom to put pen to paper and sign that bill into law, which would immediately authorize E-15 as a legal fuel in that state.
Jim Lenz: 11:49
The urgency clause, how quickly could Californians see E-15 at the pump?
Geoff Cooper: 11:55
Yeah, because the legislators who introduced this bill had the foresight, they uh attached an urgency clause to this legislation, which means that immediately upon the governor’s signature, E-15 becomes a legal fuel and should be available to the to the marketplace should retailers, should gas stations choose to offer the fuel. Now, there’s a couple of things that we think the Air Resources Board, the regulatory agency in charge, needs to do to provide some guidance and some clarity on how gas stations can offer this fuel, but that can happen in relatively short order, in our view. And we’re hopeful that by the end of the year, we could see some stations offering this fuel to consumers at a lower cost. There’s not a lot that retailers need to do to switch from E-10 to E-15. Their equipment in most cases is fully compatible. It’s ready for the transition, it’s suitable for E-15. They might have to make a few tweaks here and there, but this should be a relatively seamless transition for those gas stations who choose to offer the fuel. And again, we think lots of them will choose to offer E-15 because of its lower price, because of its cost competitiveness, and because of its environmental benefits. And we know that California is a state where drivers and consumers put a big premium on environmental performance and benefits. So we think we’re close. We believe we are on the precipice of actually seeing this fuel in the in the California marketplace after years of trying to get it there.
Jim Lenz: 13:33
Wow. Anxiously awaiting. That’s really positive news. The E15, as you said, it’s going to be marketed as lower costs. It is. I see that at the fuel pump. It’s amazing. I think I’ve seen, you know, from a personal perspective, I’m in Wisconsin, state of Wisconsin, and I think I have seen it anywhere from like eight cents to possibly 65 cents lower. Is that yeah?
Geoff Cooper: 13:57
We do see a a wide range of discounts where E-15 is being offered today. Typically, if you kind of take the averages, we we often see discounts in the range of 10 to 30 cents per gallon. That’s that’s what’s fairly typical across the Midwest where E-15 is being offered today. Sometimes you do see larger discounts than that. You know, we have seen 50, 60 cents. We’ve seen some stations offering E-15 for 80 cents or even a dollar a gallon less than E10 at certain times. So the economic benefits are clear, they’re proven. And again, we think the California uh marketplace and policymakers have seen that with their own eyes. They’ve they’ve recognized that they’re that these are benefits that they want to extend to their consumers as well.
Jim Lenz: 14:45
Consumers, of course, looking for ways to save, reduce expenses for household income. Tell me if this is correct. I thought I read $2.7 billion annual savings and $200 per household. Is where does that come from? Tell me more. Is that uh Yeah?
Geoff Cooper: 15:06
So the University of California, Berkeley, did a study in conjunction with an economist at the U.S. Naval Academy looking at what introducing E-15 could mean economically in the state of California. And those are the numbers they found. They found across the statewide economy, if Californian uh gas stations replace E-10 with E-15, that savings uh to the economy could be on the order of $2.7 billion. Now, when you look at what that means per household, yeah, it’s about $200 per California household. And when you look at what it means per gallon, their study found an average savings of around 20 cents per gallon when you look at E15 versus E10. And again, that’s very consistent with what we’ve seen in other parts of the country where E-15 is being offered today. And I, again, I want to underscore this was not an RFA research paper or study. This was not the University of Nebraska, this was not Iowa State University, this was the University of California, Berkeley, which, you know, doesn’t really have uh a dog in the hunt or an axe to grind when it comes to ethanol and E-15 and some of these issues. It was uh uh a truly objective look at what this could mean for the state’s economy, and the results I think were resoundingly positive and really confirm what we’ve seen in other parts of the country.
Jim Lenz: 16:30
That’s important that you state that. Yeah, independent mind uh not at all uh involved with this as one of the players. So we’re talking about actually, you know what? I think it might be good when we’ve been seeing E15, right? And when you’re at the pump as a consumer, I’m filling up my my vehicle, it’s 88, right? Just so everybody knows.
Geoff Cooper: 16:51
Yeah, we we do see E-15 marketed in different ways by different fuel retailers. Uh, many of them have chosen to market E-15 as unleaded 88, uh, with that 88 referring to the octane value of E-15. You know, in addition to a lower price with E-15, you’re getting a slight octane boost because as you add more ethanol, you’re adding more octane. And we know that octane is important for performance and just efficiency in the engine. So we do see it marketed as 88 unleaded or 88 octane in many places. We see it, it has various names and and sort of brands depending on what what station you go to. But anytime you see that 88 octane button, chances are it’s it’s going to be E15.
Jim Lenz: 17:38
Many other states offer that. So let’s say there’s uh someone pull up to the gas station and they fill up with E15 fuel, they know and feel good about the decision because it means lower cost to them, less expenses. But broadly speaking, outside of that positive item, we can also talk about smog and emissions, right? What’s the expected environmental and health impact for California communities?
Geoff Cooper: 18:04
Well, and and that’s a really important point. And certainly we have seen historically ethanol’s ability, and again, proven track record, to reduce smog and smog forming emissions as part of this process in California. There was an exhaustive study done where 20 vehicles were tested on E-15 compared to E10. They carefully looked at the emissions profile of each. And what they found is E-15 does reduce those emissions that contribute to smog and ground level ozone formation. And of course, that’s been a huge problem in certain parts of California. You look in the Southern California, around LA and San Diego, they have always struggled with smog in those areas. And what this study found, and this was at University of California Riverside, they found reductions in particulate matter emissions. They found reductions in carbon monoxide. They even found a slight reduction in nitrogen oxide emissions. And overall, they found lower ozone forming potential from E-15 than what you see with E10. So there is absolutely an air quality benefit to adopting E-15, and that’s been very important to California and part of this whole discussion as well. We also know that California is very focused on reducing greenhouse gas emissions, CO2 specifically coming out the tailpipe of internal combustion engines. And there’s a benefit there as well because E-15 is lower emitting when it comes to greenhouse gas emissions, both on the full life cycle picture, but also at the tailpipe. And so we see a 2.5% or 3% incremental benefit from using E-15 versus E10 when it comes to those greenhouse gas emissions. So there are clear environmental benefits, there are clear economic benefits as we’ve talked about. And you’re extending the fuel supply, you’re using a greater volume of a domestically produced product, and you’re helping farmers. And that is important to a lot of folks. And I know we’ll get into that as well.
Jim Lenz: 20:07
Yeah, so you definitely clearly stated the benefits of E15. Anything else to add why everyday drivers should care about E15?
Geoff Cooper: 20:15
I think those are the big ones. And just to break it down and be very concise here, it’s lower cost at the pump. It’s a cleaner burning fuel, lower emissions, it’s domestically produced. Those are three things that I think you ask any consumer. Those are benefits, those are values that are going to resonate with them. Some consumers may place more emphasis on one or the other. We know that most consumers are primarily driven by cost. What does it mean for their wallet? What does it mean for their pocketbook? But again, particularly in states like California, there are a lot of consumers that are motivated by what does my use of this product mean for the environment? And they can feel good about choosing E15, you know, compared to some of the other fuel options that are available.
Jim Lenz: 20:58
So we’re on the brink of something huge, but it took a lot of work. So I want to talk about with you the long road to success. RFA started on this path back in 2018 with C ARB carb. What were the biggest challenges?
Geoff Cooper: 21:12
Well, yeah, and I think it’s important for people to understand that California has its own process for approving new fuels. They don’t follow the federal process like all the other states do. EPA at the federal level, the US EPA, approved E-15 as a legal fuel all the way back in 2011. And so for the last 14 years, E-15 has been a legal fuel in 49 other states. But California had its own process, it always has, uh has its own testing requirements, et cetera. And so we’ve been trying to work with California during that entire time to get them to adopt the federal standards for E-15, or if they got to go through their own process, you know, go through it. But let’s let’s get it done. When it comes to approving new fuels, they have what’s called a multimedia evaluation that is required. And that means they have to look at the environmental impacts, the impacts on air, soil, and water of any new fuels that may be introduced in the marketplace. That requires, in in many cases, additional testing, extensive research. And that’s what they’ve said they needed to do. Well, that process finally started. We were able to convince CARB to start that evaluation in 2018, but it was taking forever for them to get on with the process. And there’s been fits and starts and delays, and that’s really what led to this legislation being drafted is again, the California Assembly said, look, we can’t we can’t afford to wait for the regulatory agencies to do what they needed to do anymore. We’re going to take the bull by the horns, we’re going to take this matter into our own hands, and we are going to pass legislation that forces the issue. So, yes, it’s been a long process, it’s been a slog. We’re not done with it yet, but we can see the light at the end of the tunnel finally. After years and years of work, and frankly, millions of dollars of investment in testing and research and studies and other things that we’ve had to do to get to the point where we’re at today.
Jim Lenz: 23:19
So that’s a good summary. After six years of regulatory delays, this is why you chose the legislative path then, right?
Geoff Cooper: 23:27
That’s right. And again, I think we about 18 months ago or two years ago said, look, we we can keep spinning our wheels and hoping that uh CARB, the regulatory agency, you know, gets in gear and moves forward with this process. But they were showing very little motivation, very little interest in doing that. And so we decided to try a different tack and talk to the legislature about this and and help members of the assembly and senate understand the opportunity that they were missing because CARB was dragging its feet on E-15. And, you know, we were successful in doing that and and got the attention, got the interest of key players in legislature. And we saw what happened this past summer. That bill essentially sailed through both chambers because they got it. And so now here we are, again, I think on the verge or on the brink of finally having E-15 in the marketplace because of the vision and the leadership that several members of the Assembly showed to get this conversation started.
Jim Lenz: 24:30
Kind of what I want to talk about, too. How important was a California problem solvers caucus and leaders like Alvarez and Flora?
Geoff Cooper: 24:38
Well, I to put it simply, this would not have happened without their leadership. Assemblymember Alvarez, Assemblymember Flora. They immediately got it. They immediately understood the opportunity. Uh, this was a no-brainer for them. They they were they were shocked that California hadn’t already moved on this. They were frustrated that uh carb has been dragging its feet for so many years. Both uh Alvarez and Flora are part of the Problem Solvers Caucus, which is a bipartisan group of legislators in California that, as the name implies, they want to solve problems. And they know that a major problem in that state today is the high cost of fuel at the pump. California has the highest gas prices in the country. It’s been that way for years. They know it’s going to get worse before it gets better as refineries are closing down and moving out of the state. So as they looked at that problem, they said E-15 is a solution. It’s not going to solve all the problems, but it’s a solution and it and it should be an easy one. It makes sense. There’s no reason not to do this. It’s a win-win for you know fuel prices, but also for the environment, as we’ve discussed. And so they really took this cause up and ran with it. We’re incredibly effective in convincing their colleagues in the legislature that this was a worthy cause and that this is something simple that the legislature could do to help consumers out, help everyday Californians get through the month and and save some money at the end of the day. So we’re very grateful to their leadership and their support and them taking the time to understand these issues and and their advocacy. So it really was a tremendously effective partnership that we had with the problem solvers caucus. And again, without their work, we we wouldn’t be here.
Jim Lenz: 26:28
You and your organization are instrumental in building coalitions, right? This could not have happened with that. And so just to give listeners understanding, you’re talking about coalitions bringing together retailers, farmers, and producers, truckers, labor, chamber of commerce, and more. How did that come together?
Geoff Cooper: 26:48
Well, again, we know the only way to succeed when you’re promoting and advocating for legislation is to have a big tent and bring as many stakeholders into that tent as possible and as many supporters as possible. Certain groups have better relationships with certain lawmakers than we do, and and vice versa. So the whole idea was let’s grow this coalition of support for E-15 as large as we can. Let’s talk to business groups, let’s talk. I mean, we had veterans groups involved, we had, as you said, truckers, retailers, senior groups, retirees. And again, it’s it’s not a hard sell, right? If you can get five or 10 minutes of their time and say, here are the benefits from doing this, here are the benefits from E-15. Why on earth is California not, you know, taking this opportunity? I mean, the light bulb immediately goes on, and people understand how this benefits their individual constituencies, and they’re happy to jump on board and help the cause. And so, yeah, I’ve been very pleased and pleasantly surprised by the amount of support and the diversity of support that we were able to garner for this legislation.
Jim Lenz: 27:59
I was in an ethanol plant in Iowa in the month of August, and it is uh almost breathtaking, beautiful, I have to say, of the big amounds of coal products that are part of the ethanol process industry, which many people know, and I know there’s some listeners that don’t realize those coal products. Dr. Kurt Rosentrader from Iowa State University, he’s been on the show and he does a lot of speaking and is a professor again at Iowa State University, does a lot of work in this space and uh talks about coal products, used for cattle, used for chickens, uh used emerging things and fish production operations and and so many more. Uh I mean I think people need to realize that the grain industry, if you look at all other industries, has got to be one of the most efficient industries on the planet. Wouldn’t you agree?
Geoff Cooper: 28:59
Absolutely. And and you’re you’re you’re 100% correct. The ethanol process today is zero waste. We you put a bushel of corn in the front end of an ethanol plant, the starch portion of those corn kernels is fermented into ethanol. That’s what becomes the fuel. Everything else becomes livestock feed. The protein, the fat, the fiber, the other nutrients that are in that corn kernel remain available to the livestock feed supply chain. And that is incredibly important. Distiller’s grains have become one of the largest single components of the feed industry here in the United States. And we’re also exporting about a third of the distiller’s grains that we produce because livestock and poultry feeders around the world understand the benefits of including this low cost component in their feed rations. And back to the conversation on California. Guess what? California has a lot of chickens. They have a lot of dairies. They’re all using distiller’s grains. And that’s why, you know, when we went and talked to the California Farm Bureau and other farm groups in the state, they’re like, oh yeah, we absolutely support this. We love distiller’s grains. If there’s more of that supply available because we’re using more fuel, more E15, more ethanol, yeah, that’s that’s a win-win for us as well. So it is an incredibly important piece of the puzzle that a lot of people, you know, outside of our industry don’t understand about the ethanol process. And you’re right, you go to an ethanol plant and you see that pile for the first time, and it really hits you just how much animal feed the ethanol industry is is producing and and what a vital component of the feed market that is today.
Jim Lenz: 30:45
Yeah, I think lawmakers may not realize that. I mean, that’s a big piece. That efficiency, those cool products, it’s just uh ripple effects. In fact, let’s do that. Uh actually before we get to the ripple effects, I just I guess this is part of the ripple effects industries, grain industry for sure, and other industries, but there’s always going to be tough policy environments in just uh a few sentences or just what do you think? What are lessons that you learned or your organization learned and and those you partnered with that could be applied to other tough policy environments?
Geoff Cooper: 31:19
Well, I I think through this California process, one of the lessons learned, or or maybe one of the lessons confirmed, I guess, would be a better way of saying it for us, is you’ve got to have coalitions. You you’ve got to have, you’ve got to bring along other important constituencies, got to bring along other groups of voters that other lawmakers care about if you want to succeed. And and we certainly have seen that in California. We talked about the coalition we were able to build there. And that is something that we’ve got to do a better job of translating and transferring to other policy battles that we’re fighting at the federal level in in other states. We we’ve got to remember that when we can go to a legislative body with a broad and diverse group of supporters, that ups our chances of success exponentially. You know, you may have a lawmaker that that is very focused on issues for seniors and retirees, and that’s really what drives them. If if you’ve got a group representing that constituency that is with you, voicing its support for this legislation, now now you’ve got another champion. Now you’ve got another friend in that legislative body. So I think that’s the biggest takeaway is to truly succeed with these legislative approaches, you’ve got to have broad-based support. Nobody can do this alone. We certainly, as just the ethanol industry, could have never achieved this victory without working with all of those other groups that we’ve talked about that were part of that coalition.
Jim Lenz: 32:50
That’s a great summary, confirmed lessons from this big project and effort. Now, let’s look at ripple effects beyond California. California often sets trends nationally. How could this influence federal year-round E-15 legislation?
Geoff Cooper: 33:07
Well, and that’s another really unique uh piece of the story in California, is because they have their own fuel regulations and specifications and you know air quality regulations, they don’t have the same summertime barrier to E-15. So once this fuel is approved fully, once it’s in the marketplace in California, they’re not going to have that same hurdle every summer that most of the other states in the country have. We think that is going to be tremendously helpful in helping to rapidly expand the use of E-15 in the state of California. And then I think, you know, other states can look at that model and say, yeah, this is what can happen when you don’t have that summertime barrier. And if you can sell E-15 year-round, 365 days a year, it’s it’s going to sell. Consumers want it, they’re going to buy it. Things can expand rapidly if we just clear away these barriers. And so I think California is going to be a good test case to really show that yes, this volatility, this vapor pressure issue has been a serious impediment in the rest of the country that has prevented more rapid adoption of E-15. And if there are ways to clear that away, which there are, then things can really take off. And I think that’s going to be, you know, one of the signals that is sent by California moving to E-15.
Jim Lenz: 34:32
Signals. Interesting. With California on board, does this change the narrative in Washington?
Geoff Cooper: 34:38
Uh I think it it does to some extent because it also I think gets the attention of some of those lawmakers in Washington who, like California, the last 10 years, have believed that the only way to clean up transportation fuels is to get rid of them and move to electric vehicles. And let’s eliminate the internal combustion engine, let’s eliminate liquid fuels, and let’s just rush headlong into electric vehicles for everybody. But now you’ve got California saying, uh, uh, we’re taking a step back from that approach because so far it isn’t working very well. And we’re looking at other options to kind of ease that transition or ease that glide path. And E-15 is one of those. So I do think this is going to change the conversation in Washington, where we have had some, especially on the left side of the aisle, who have thought, well, we’re sort of, you know, are we wasting our time with E-15? It doesn’t offer, you know, substantial environmental benefits over E-10, uh, which of course we would argue otherwise, and maybe get them thinking about more incremental approaches and wake them up to the fact that yes, E-15 absolutely does provide benefits, both environmentally but also in terms of the pocketbook for consumers who are who are struggling right now. So yeah, I I again I think there’s going to be lots of positive lessons learned from California’s experience, and and it’ll be interesting to see how that translates into federal action.
Jim Lenz: 36:05
Yeah, absolutely. You think this could be just a huge uh leaning forward and making this happen and it’s exciting. Thank you for what you have done for ethanol production and changing a mindset. There’s an education that takes place during all this. I know you right now have team members. I’ve seen it on LinkedIn, a couple of them who are doing workshops in preparation for this. That’s what I’m telling you. Thank you for doing that. You want to just give them some some note of what you and team are doing?
Geoff Cooper: 36:37
You’re absolutely right. It’s all about education. And again, the real key here is just finding the time and getting the time. And sometimes it only takes 10 minutes. It only takes 15 minutes, but getting someone’s undivided attention for that period of time to explain to them and provide the facts on what we’re doing in the ethanol industry, why we’re doing it, what the impacts are, what the benefits are. Again, it’s it’s not a hard sell. It’s it’s easy to get people bought in if you just have that opportunity to explain some of these things and dispel some of the myths that they’ve heard about ethanol over the years, right? It’s it’s not hard to uh develop new champions and new advocates if you can just get their undivided attention. So we are doing that in California today in conjunction with all the legislative activity. We’re also hosting and sponsoring a series of workshops for gas station owners, for fuel marketers, for companies that supply dispensers and tanks and other equipment to that sector to get them up to speed on E-15. Again, the fuel hasn’t been available, it hasn’t been legal in the state. And so a lot of them don’t have any idea what E-15 is even is. And so we’re kind of starting at square one, just doing the basic education on here’s what E-15 is, here’s what would be required for you to offer it, and here are the benefits. And so we are covering the state with those workshops. We’ve already had several that have been completed, have I think another eight or ten scheduled over the next month or so. And again, the the idea, the goal of those workshops is just to get the fuel supply chain in that state familiarized with E-15, up to speed on what’s happened with the legislation, and most importantly, get them to understand the benefits of offering this fuel to their customers.
Jim Lenz: 38:27
I love strategy, but the execution of the strategy is most important. So when I saw that they were doing workshops, that just all makes sense. And you said press by the end of this year that could happen. It doesn’t happen if you don’t prepare and educate. So after this, very good news, did so much work to that. But no, you are not stopping. You’re executing on this all the way to what’s the primary goal is. Fantastic. What does this mean for Midwest ethanol producers and the grain professionals who supply them?
Geoff Cooper: 38:58
Yeah, yeah, that and that’s that’s a great question and and an important question. And when we look at California, it is one of the single largest consumers of of gasoline in in the country. They’re typically number one or number two in terms of how much gasoline they consume. And again, we all know they’ve been moving toward electrification and EVs and trying to reduce liquid fuel consumption. But the the fact of the matter is they’re the most populous state in the country. And so they they have the most vehicles in the country and they still use a lot of gasoline. Last year they used about 14 billion gallons of gasoline. Almost all of that contained 10% ethanol. So it’s one of our largest ethanol markets. 1.4 billion gallons of ethanol we’ve been consuming in the state of California. If that is all replaced by E15, and that’s not going to happen overnight, but when that eventually happens, now you’re growing the market for ethanol in the state by another 600, 700 million gallons, right? And so you asked what that means for Midwest ethanol producers. Well, yeah, now you’ve got new demand, a new source of demand for six or seven hundred million gallons of product. That’s the output from six or seven average sized ethanol plants, right? And then you look at the ripple impacts. Well, what does that mean for the corn grower? What does that mean for the grain handler? Well, you know, to make six or seven hundred million gallons of ethanol, we need 200 or 250 million bushels of corn. And that’s got to come from somewhere. So it’s a demand boost for the farmer, it’s increased throughput for the grain handler, more rail cars, more trucks, more storage, more elevation. It’s so it really does ripple across the entire sector and create new demand opportunities and new value opportunities. And that’s really, really what we’re after.
Jim Lenz: 40:49
Huge ripple effect. Grain in the United States is transported around the world. So I can’t not think further. I would love your thoughts on this. Could this open doors internationally as well?
Geoff Cooper: 41:09
Well, it it can, and and we think it already is. We think there are countries around the world that, of course, are watching what we do very closely in the ethanol industry here in the U.S. We are the world’s leader in terms of ethanol production and also the volume of ethanol consumed. When they see states like California moving to higher blends, you know, 15% ethanol, that that again is a signal that is being sent around the world to countries like Japan and Vietnam and Indonesia and you know, countries in Europe that look, the U.S. is continuing to increase its use of this low-carbon, lower cost fuel. They’re seeing the benefits. We need to see those benefits as well. And frankly, we’re seeing countries like India, who 10 years ago blended almost no ethanol whatsoever. And they are quickly on a trajectory to be blending E20 nationwide, 20% ethanol nationwide. And a lot of what’s driving that is looking at the experience in other countries, what we’ve done here in the U.S., what the Brazilians have done with their ethanol industry. So, yes, every time we see a state taking action like California is taking, it’s not just important for California, it’s not just important for Washington, D.C. People around the world are paying attention. And again, that’s a signal that that could be, we think will be overall positive for the U.S.
Jim Lenz: 42:35
ethanol industry. Fantastic. Okay, real briefly, the road ahead. Next steps, Jeff. What’s still needed from carb and regulators, even if A B 30 is signed?
Geoff Cooper: 42:46
Yeah, so again, we believe A B 30 will be signed into law by Governor Newsome sometime soon. And at that point, the the fuel is a legal fuel in the state. Uh, but you’re going to have gas stations, you’re going to have suppliers saying, okay, well, now that it’s legal, how do we actually, you know, offer this fuel? And so we do believe there are going to be some things that CARB, uh the regulator in charge, needs to do to lay out uh some interim guidance, some temporary guidance to those companies that want to offer this fuel that explains how to do it in a way that is compliant with their regulations. We think that can be easily done. We don’t think it should take a lot of time. We saw just yesterday that Carb has already scheduled a workshop on October 14th to begin this conversation, which is great news. But, you know, we don’t see a reason to wait. We need to get guidance out to the fuel sector as soon as possible so they know what they need to do to offer this fuel. So those are the next steps. And then, you know, longer term, CARB is going to continue doing its finishing up its process, and they expect that could take some time to create a formal fuel specification and and and some of the other things required. But in the interim, because of this legislation, it will be law that E-15 is illegal fuel and they need to take steps to make sure that gas stations can offer it.
Jim Lenz: 44:10
Fantastic. And you confirm that RFA is supporting retailers and suppliers through workshops and education. That’s fantastic. Well done. What should stakeholders from grain handlers to fuel marketers watch for in the coming months?
Geoff Cooper: 44:24
Well, uh, yeah, I think there’s going to be a couple of key milestones to look out for. And one of those, of course, is going to be the governor signing the bill. Again, we expect that to happen soon. The the second one to watch for is some sort of interim or temporary guidance from carb, as we’ve discussed, that gives retailers and and terminal operators and others more clarity on how to offer E-15. And then I think the the third piece to watch very closely is the conclusion of CARB’s formal rulemaking process. And again, we don’t think it should take that long, but they’ve said that could take up to a year or so. But the bottom line is E-15 should be available very soon in the state, thanks to this legislation, even while CARB is finishing its formal regulatory process.
Jim Lenz: 45:11
Awesome. Awesome. Now, a quick recap here AB 30, it’s ways to deliver lower prices. You also shared cleaner air and expanded markets. But also, I think on behalf of the Jeeps organization, we thank you and the RFA organization for what you’re doing and developing a coalition. Yes, you are lowering prices for fuel. Yes, you are providing cleaner air, and yes, you’re providing expanded markets, but also you’re supporting families from those heavily needed producers and farmers all the way through the supply chain, the grain handling and processing facilities. You have all those transportation trucking and rail and shipping, and it’s just incredible what you’ve done to support them. And of course, all the retailers that support those organizations. Thank you for what you’ve done. You’ve been a terrific guest. You provided all these incredible insights, and your leadership has been just so incredible, not just for your organization and who you serve, but just for the whole grain industry in general. So thank you so much.
Geoff Cooper: 46:10
Well, thanks for meeting with me and having the conversation today, Jim. I I I I really appreciate the work that you all do and Jeeps does, and certainly appreciate you putting a spotlight on the importance of this development in California and what it means for the entire economy and certainly what it means for agriculture and the folks that our two organizations represent. You you mentioned just the ripple impacts that this can have, and they are substantial. So thank you again for shining some light on that.
Jim Lenz: 46:37
This is huge news. Listeners, you just heard it. This is Geoff Cooper, CEO of RFA, the Renewable Fuels Association. If you like this episode, and I know you will and do, I encourage you to also listen to another Jeeps Whole Grain Podcast episode by his colleague, Robert White. It provides a really good foundation overview and the impact of ethanol production in our world. So I encourage you to do that. Thank you, Jeff, so much for serving as guests in the Whole Grain Podcast. Thanks again for having me. That wraps up today’s episode of the GEAPS Whole Grain Podcast. A big thank you to Geoff Cooper, president and CEO of the Renewable Fuels Association, for joining us and for sharing the story behind this historic milestone into renewable fuels. As we’ve heard today, California’s decision to open the door to E-15 isn’t just a policy win, it’s a pivotal moment that could reshape fuel markets, strengthen demand for grain, and accelerate our industry’s role in building a cleaner, more sustainable future? I’d like to leave you with a few questions to reflect on and perhaps discuss with your team. How might the legalization of E-15 in California affect demand for grain and ethanol in your region? What lessons can our industry learn from the coalition building and persistence that made AB30 possible? How could federal year-round E-15 policy change the future of grain handling and processing? And finally, what steps can your facility take today to prepare for the opportunities this shift will bring? Remember, GEAPS Grain Elevator and Processing Society offers resources to help you grow and stay ahead, including over 25 online and on-demand courses, hands-on training offerings, a searchable library of over 200 industry videos, interactive webinars, our next gen path program for interns and those early in their careers, a globally recognized credentialing program for emerging leaders and veterans of the industry, digital grain glossary, local chapters for networking and maintenance day programs, and so much more. And of course, don’t miss GEAPS Exchange, the industry’s premier event. Visit GEAPS.com. That’s G-E-A-P-S dot com to explore more ways to learn, grow, and connect. I’m Jim Lenz, Director of Global Education and Training at GEAPS. Thanks for listening, and until next time, keep feeding, fueling, and clothing the world.
